Wiki Elimination of “A” Designation: The Apprentice designation is not needed anymore

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The following is a shortened version of an article from the AAPC Coding Edge magazine January 2012 issue written by Reed E. Pew, AAPC Chairman and CEO.


Effective July 1, 2012, the CPC-A credential will no longer be granted. All current CPC-As would have their “A” removed by doing one of the following:
1. Getting at least one year of on-the-job experience no later than 12/31/2013, (helpful to those with a job and currently working towards that end)
2. Successfully passing a clinical exam consisting of coding 20 operative/office notes.
3. No current CPC-A would be grandfathered into the CPC credential.

Those taking the CPC exam after July 1, 2012 will have two ways to get their CPC credential:
1. Have one year of coding experience prior to taking the CPC exam with proof given at the time of the exam, and then pass the CPC exam or
2. Pass both the CPC exam and a clinical exam by coding 20 operative/office notes.
On the job experience after taking the CPC exam will not be required. It does not matter in which order the two exams are taken.

The clinical exam will include a sampling of office visits, surgical notes, E/M coding, ancillary services, modifier usage, and diagnosis coding. A 90% pass rate on the clinical exam will be required and will be determined by correctly coding 18 of the 20 notes. The clinical exam will not be multiple choice, it will be free form and hand graded. The same 5 hours and 40 minutes time restriction and code books will be allowed, and the clinical exam can be taken at any AAPC proctored exam site.

Both exams will be paid for at the same time and the cost for both exams will increase by $35. Applicants may still take each exam twice to pass it. If the examinee already has one year experience, then he or she would pay only the CPC exam price. If one exam is passed after two attempts, but not the other, then the fee for the exam not passed would be paid to retake it.

Of course, current CPCs are not affected by this change. We would appreciate comments to this important change to our credentialing program through 1/31/2012. You may go to www.aapc.com/cpc-acomment to submit your comment. From those comments, we will either proceed ahead, make modifications that strengthen the change, or slow down the change due to legitimate concerns that AAPC has not properly considered.​


To me this sounds promising. Though I'm not looking forward to spending a total of over 11 hours of testing time and paying for two exams, but whatever it takes and hopefully it'll better help me reach my goals. I'm not fond of the $35 increase of the CPC exam price, and they don't mention how much the clinical exam will be, either.

I'm presuming AAPC has terminated the "Virtual Experience: Apprentice Removal" program. I was seriously thinking of signing up for that, but now am glad I didn't. I feel badly for those that started that program and were unable to complete it because AAPC brought the program's website down sometime last year. I would hope AAPC would recognize those that started it and give them some sort of credit towards this new clinical exam, at least financially.
 
I was impressed to read AAPC is encouraging feedback on this decision.

Now, if the industry would eliminate outsourcing of coding jobs to foreign countries, 2012 would be prosperous for more coders.
 
I think that the AAPC is moving in the right direction, by requiring experience in order to be certified. However, the AAPC is in a quandry, in that they really can't leave all of those inexperienced coder apprentices out to dry. They've suffered enough, don't you think? The AAPC has to come up with a reasonable way to move those CPC-As into the CPC designation before it's too late, while maintaining the integrity of the certification (although I am not sure that 20 notes substitutes for a year of sitting in the midst of the revenue cycle). Regardless, I like the format of the exam; it requires some solid coding know-how and independent thinking in order to pass. It's a fair compromise, and will likely provide us with some sharp new CPCs.

On a go-forward basis, I would prefer that we require at least a year's experience, preferably two...in the medical office setting, medical records, front desk, billing or even coding in order to sit for the CPC exam. I think that the 20-question exam is an appropriate (short term) stop-gap to further certify the current apprentices, but I absoultely disagree that it's sufficient to credential a new CPC. I have long felt that the apprentice designation diluted the certification as a whole....it assumed that as long as you could pass the exam, even if you'd never set foot in a physician's office before, you could code. But I'm only speaking from experience as a hiring manager, who has had to endlessly train new apprentices.

By the way, who's going to tell all those career schools and community colleges??
 
None of this really makes ANY sense to me. I graduated from an AAPC- approved 1 yr. rigorous coding school 1 yr. ago. At the same time, I was/am pursuing an A.S. degree in Health Information Technology (will graduate in May and then take the RHIT exam). I passed the AAPC certification exam as a CPC-A. I have been very diligent trying to get any experience to get rid of the "A" on the end. I have tried to participate in the Apprentice program that AAPC offers, with the closest office being 45 minutes away from me and they had nothing available for me. My question to ALL seasoned coders, hiring managers, etc.. is how do we gain experience (and therefore get rid of the "A" on our credential) if no one is willing to hire non-experienced coders??? You can't get experience if you don't have any experience!!! It is highly FRUSTRATING!!!!! Passing the CPC exam was grueling in and of its self only to be "awarded" with a credential that means nothing...and even less than nothing if you have the scarlet "A' attached. Woopee, now I get to pay more money, and take yet another test to get rid of the "A".....and guess what, still no experience, so still NO JOB!!!!!

I am highly-motivated and generally possess a positive attitude, but this whole thing really rubs me the wrong way!!! Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated!! Happy New Year!!
:confused::mad::(
 
I have to agree with you. I have worked in the medical field in various capacities for the last 20+ years. I was offered an opportunity to participate in a class that was given to several employees in a local billing office by a certified instructor. Although not a formal class, I participated for over a half a year, attended all but one of the weekly classes and did all of the required work. I am proud to say that I passed the CPC exam on my first try, and, I was the only one of eight students who passed on the first try. The test was grueling, both mentally and physically.
I now feel that my efforts may have been wasted since my passing that test will basically mean nothing unless I take and pass the new test. I don't feel it's fair that I will have to sit for another 5 1/2 hour exam, which is what I will be required to do given the nature of job openings for coders in my town. Most practices here don't even hire certified coders. The few that do, require 5 years experience. Extern programs are all but non-existent. The ones I checked on require that an extern work during the day. Unfortunately, I have to work at my full-time job in order to pay my bills so this would be impossible. In addition, even if I pass the add-on exam, it will still not give me the coding 'experience' that is required to get a job. I don't see how this is helping apprentices at all. It appears to me that only the AAPC stands to gain since apprenticies will be required to pay additional money to take another exam.
While I'm at it, I will also say that I know of serveral 'certified' coders who do not have the required experience, but still their employers were willing to write letters for them so they didn't have to have the "A". If this "A" is so important that maybe ALL coders need to take both exams so that it will be a level playing field.
I will carefully consider what to do since this will now become an issue for me and I'm sure for so many others. I will also make sure to bring this up at my local chapter meeting, which I attend faithfully.
Thanks so much for making my day!
 
Apprentice "A" is ridiculous!!

This "A" designation is absolutely ridiculous! What other field has such a thing?
I am an RN and when I took my registered nursing exam and passed, I was awarded the title of Registered Nurse (RN). There was no scarlet letter on my sleeve that said I was new and inexperienced. That's what the resume and hopefully interview is about. What I as a new RN could bring to the job and my skill set/experience came through in my discussion w/ the RN hiring manager. I was as much a RN when I first received my results that I had passed as I am today after 25 years experience. No "newbie" designation required!

I just took the CPC exam and thought it was one of the most, if not "the" most difficult exams I've ever taken. Particularly in the face of the 5 hr. 40 min. time limit. If you can pass this exam, why in the world would yet another exam be needed?! As with all national exams for certification in a particular field, that IS the proof of proficiency! CEU's are needed to further expand on one's expertise in the coding field each year and that is what elevates the coders knowledge, not this philosophy of yet another test!!
 
Pam, I was hoping that you'd respond to this current thread. And, seeing that this is a spin-off to another active thread with the same subject felt reposting might be appropriate..

Why not simplify the process instead? Why not revamp the actual CPC exam to include scenarios where codes must be selected rather than subsisting entirely of multiple choice questions. The exam is difficiult enough as it is, but by adding this element would really go the one step necessary to test the capability of those testing. Remove the A, and let the resume speak for itself as the candidate and prospective employer can discuss the experience factor. JUST A THOUGHT to add to the mixture---Suzanne E. Byrum CPC
 
Apprentice "A" for CPC

I too am an "Apprentice", for sake of a better term. I graduated from a one year AAPC accredited school with coding occurring throughout the course of the class. I have been with a billing and coding company for 21 months, of which, 14 of them have been in the coding department. My supervisor will not approve a letter from corporate for me, beacuse I do not code 'all' of the types of ASC cases that we code for.
I was trained on how to properly look for and code for ANY type scenerio. I have a "A" hanging over my head, and with the limited range of coding that I am doing, I am not certain that my employer would give me a good reccomendation should I choose to apply elsewhere as a coder. It is frustrating to have to jump through so many hoops, when dependant upon your state, the carrier, and the contract, coding will NEVER be the same from one local to the next. That is why we must continue with our CEU's and the "A" should not exist.
I understand if your employer places restraints on your coding until such a time that he/she feels confident with your abilities as a coder, but what employer doesn't do that anyway, no matter what job your have? And I too have 25+ years experience in the healthcare field and found that this test was challening, but rewarding. I had one hour remaining when I completed my exam, and passed with an 83%, so WHY do I have to sit with an "A", when I can obviously code?
 
Many moons ago when i took my exam you were required to have at least two years of experience (and a letter stating such fromyour employer). Why the AAPC moved away from that I don't know. Pam is right the AAPC can't leave alll those CPC-A's hanging out to dry, but in order for the credentials to be taken seriously (and for years they weren't) there has to be some sort of segue. I like the idea of actually coding from the notes rather than a multiple choice test. As difficult as people feel the test is, it doesn't begin to compare with abstracting information from a patient record where not everything is neatly in place for you.

As for other fields requiring apprentices, physican are not allowed to hang up a shingle once they complete medical school, they are required to go through both an internship and residency. Plumbers, electricians and carpenters all have apprenticeships. And nurses are required to go through clinical rotations PRIOR to graduation.

Years ago before managed care, HIPAA, the ACA, CERTS, RACs and ZPICs it was easy to walk into a medical office and do any job. Now all that has changed and from my experience, most of the coding courses do not adequately prepare new coders for the "real world". People who have other experience in the medical field are more prepared, but most new coders have never set foot in a medical office except as a patient. One thing the AAPC has accomplished with the apprentice designation is to over saturate the field with inexperienced coders. What is the answer? I'm not sure, but I agree with Pam, I think the AAPC is heading in the right direction.
 
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C Shaffer, CPC-A

I'm a CPC-A and I am quite unsure of what I now may need to do to get the"A" lifted from my credential. I have a particular concern with this change because I actually did sign up and work through, all but about 100 of the 800, doctor notes for the Online Apprentice Removal Program this past summer when the site went down and I was not able to complete it. I am sure there are some of you who have read some of my posts since this all went down, and you are probably tired of hearing about it, but let me just share my story once more...

I decided last summer to take some time off from a job I had as a Medical Assistant, which I had worked for 14 months. I thought this was going to be my "foot-in-the-door", but it was clear it was not going to happen with this practice due to nature of it being a small practice( one doctor), no room to move up. Anyway, I decided to leave the practice-due to other unfortunate reasons as well, to per sue the Online Apprentice Program. I dedicated my ENTIRE summer to try and finish this with the hopes of finishing by fall, so I could get back to work with this experience behind me. I literally worked all day, and night, every single day this past summer (from 8:00 am to at least 10:00 pm). Unfortunately, the site went down when I had about 100 to do in order to finish. This was in Aug/Sept, and I have been patiently waiting for the site to come back up so I could finish. I even participated in helping with providing feedback to the AAPC during this time. I want to say that having nearly finished this program, it was very exhausting and every bit as grueling as the CPC exam. I feel I have worked extremely hard, and dedicated a large amount of time working on this progam, only to possibly have it no longer be available as an option for removing my "A" status. I signed up for this program because it allowed me to do it on my own time, at my own pace, and from home. I think the idea of this program was a good one in that it teaches you not just what to code, but if you submit incorrectly, to do some research to find the correct codes, and understand why you may have an incorrect code. I think a coder gets a better understanding of the process as a whole. If you sit for a test consisting of only 20 notes, and have a time limit how is this considered an apprentice program where a new coder is being prepared for real world? Everyone needs to be trained for any job, and there aren't many employers willing to train a coder, so I think an apprentice program should be an option to train and further teach a new coder to prepare them for the real world. New coders still need experience to get a job, they cannot get a job and then sit for the test, because they won't be hired without the credential either. And it is another, additional expense.

All this being said, there definately needs to be a change on how new coders can obtain the experience, and the credential, to help them gain the employment. But from my point of view, I am very upset about how this is potentially going to affect me. I have spent a large amount of time, AND money persuing this credential/education. I am beginning to feel I have wasted alot of my time, money, AND energy trying to obtain this credential. Maybe I should go back to Accounting, where I DO have the experience, in addition to a degree from a state college. I love the medical feild and I have the compassion for this line of work, and I thought I had found where I belonged, but I have to say this has been a dissapointing experience. I hope those at the AAPC will read my post and try to help me understand what exactly MY options are now....?
 
Apprentice

This is quite a surprise.

Basically, AAPC is moving the goal post so that rather than allow you to sit for the exam and THEN get one year of work experience on your own before getting the full credential, now you will be required to already have a year of experience before you can even sit for the exam - unless, of course, you're willing to take not one, but TWO five hour and forty minute exams, and, of course, pay AAPC for this priviledge. (The orginal post didn't specify the cost of this new exam, but I can only assume that if the same time limit is alloted for it, the cost will probably be the same as the first exam - $295 for members, including the $35 price increase - a total of $590 for two exams, which according the president's announcement, must be paid for up front at the same time.)

It appears AAPC has painted itself into a corner and found itself with a LOT of newly certified (CPC-A) coders and is trying to find a way to still collect money for membership dues, online courses, books, practice exams, study guides, and exam fees without diluting the integrity of the certification by having too many certified coders flooding the market.

As it stands, it looks pretty grim for those of us struggling to break into this field. If employers were reluctant (at best) to take a chance on a coder with an Apprentice designation, they certainly aren't going to jump at the chance to hire a candidate with NO certification and NO work experience.

I challenge any senior coders and hiring managers to take the chance on that eager, enthusiastic new graduate and/or newly certified coder and reap the benefits of establishing a relationship of trust and loyalty that will pay big dividends.

Just my two cents.
 
I really hope the AAPC puts some more extensive thought into this before they rush forward. I like that they give an opportunity for students with no experience to get certified. Students come to school and work really hard to learn this stuff, and then pursue a career. There is no reason they should be required to have the career first, before they can get certified. If you think it is difficult to get a job with the CPC-A credential, try getting your foot in the door with nothing.

I see nothing wrong with the apprentice title. I would be fine with it going away too, but what I don't want to see is students not be able to pursue certification at all because they don't have experience. That seems backwards to me.
 
Although I think gaining experience is the key to successful coding, I have to disagree with parts of this proposal. Take the people who just passed the rigorous CPC exam for instance, like myself. We went into this process knowing that passing the exam would give you the CPC-A status, like all of the CPCs before us. To remove this status, one has to prove on-the-job training. This is great. You pass the exam and get the training needed to code "in the real world" without time limits. Now the AAPC proposes to put a time limit on when the apprentice can submit this letter (December 2013, I believe). But did anyone think about the fact that the AAPC are favoring those who are already in the medical field. I have decided to change careers like many people out there. We are stuck in a horrible economy (not to mention I am living in the state with the worst unemployment rating) and not able to find jobs. It disgusts me that I studied hard and passed the exam, only now the AAPC is saying that it is not good enough. Not to mention some of my fellow test takers will only have to have their employer write them a letter, when I will have to sit through another rigorous exam. This is absolutely not fair! I feel you are not doing me any favors by taking off the -A designation (and making me sit for another exam), because as the proposal reads, it only tells the employer that you do not have experience. But with or without the -A, my resume shows that I do not have on-the-job experience...that I only have educational training. What harm is it to leave this -A for the people who already have it until they have the opportunity to get the on-the-job training needed (with no time limits)? This way they can phase out the -A designation without changing the process altogether. The people who are getting ready to take the CPC exam understand what will be needed of them (2 exams totaling almost 11 hours--ouch), and not take the exam and find out (only a few days later in my instance) that because you do not have have a job in the industry, you have to sit through another gut wrenching exam. I am not asking for a free pass (being grandfathered into CPC status), only that I have the same opportunity as those who are in the medical field and were sitting for the exam at the same time as I. I feel that the AAPC should just revamp the old test if they feel that straight coding is needed and remove the -A designation for current test takers. For those who already have the CPC-A, let them follow the protocol the AAPC laid out for them and gain the on-the-job experience in there own time (since there are no jobs out there right now). I ask that the AAPC please re-evaluate their proposal before rushing forward.
 
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As I stated earlier I think this is fantastic. I have no problem with expecting newly certified coders to also sit for a 20 question non multiple choice exam. I am also good with revamping the existing exam to be all fill in the blank with op notes to code. The idea is with no experience you have to show that you can take the ball and run with it. I have run into many new coders that cannot code without someone first giving them the suggestion of what the code might be. You have to be able to think independently. The provider is selecting the codes in todays world with the way the EMR is set up, but many times they are incorrect, a coder needs to know how to read the note and to be able to extract the correct codes. I worked with a billing service not long ago. they had many newly certified coders and those wanting to become certified. They allowed them to work to get the experience and then sit for the exam so as not to have an A. I suggested an exam to determine the level of expertise for each coder, a test was administered that was fill in and used the op notes and office notes from their clients. Easy right? there were only twelve questions and only 3 were op notes. It took everyone a full 8 hours to answer the questions, and the highest percentage achieved was 35%! They were all angry because the test was not multiple choice. This told me then why there were so many rejected claims and why so many denials were not being appealed. They were using the codes "suggested" by the physicians without ever considering they could be incorrect.
So to take a part of a test or even an entire test that is not multiple choice is a good thing, it is a true measure of your abilities to code. I am not sure why you would not welcome the opportunity. As far as the AAPC goes I think it is good for them to elevate the credential. I also think they are really working in the best interest of the coder by making it more apparent to the future employer that AAPC coders really do know how to code.
 
marver said:
Although I think gaining experience is the key to successful coding, I have to disagree with parts of this proposal. Take the people who just passed the rigorous CPC exam for instance, like myself. We went into this process knowing that passing the exam would give you the CPC-A status, like all of the CPCs before us. To remove this status, one has to prove on-the-job training. This is great. You pass the exam and get the training needed to code "in the real world" without time limits. Now the AAPC proposes to put a time limit on when the apprentice can submit this letter (December 2013, I believe). But did anyone think about the fact that the AAPC are favoring those who are already in the medical field. I have decided to change careers like many people out there. We are stuck in a horrible economy (not to mention I am living in the state with the worst unemployment rating) and not able to find jobs. It disgusts me that I studied hard and passed the exam, only now the AAPC is saying that it is not good enough. Not to mention some of my fellow test takers will only have to have their employer write them a letter, when I will have to sit through another rigorous exam. This is absolutely not fair! I feel you are not doing me any favors by taking off the -A designation (and making me sit for another exam), because as the proposal reads, it only tells the employer that you do not have experience. But with or without the -A, my resume shows that I do not have on-the-job experience...that I only have educational training. What harm is it to leave this -A for the people who already have it until they have the opportunity to get the on-the-job training needed (with no time limits)? This way they can phase out the -A designation without changing the process altogether. The people who are getting ready to take the CPC exam understand what will be needed of them (2 exams totaling almost 11 hours--ouch), and not take the exam and find out (only a few days later in my instance) that because you do not have have a job in the industry, you have to sit through another gut wrenching exam. I am not asking for a free pass (being grandfathered into CPC status), only that I have the same opportunity as those who are in the medical field and were sitting for the exam at the same time as I. I feel that the AAPC should just revamp the old test if they feel that straight coding is needed and remove the -A designation for current test takers. For those who already have the CPC-A, let them follow the protocol the AAPC laid out for them and gain the on-the-job experience in there own time (since there are no jobs out there right now). I ask that the AAPC please re-evaluate their proposal before rushing forward.
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No one is forcing existing CPC-A's to take the additional exam. Yes, taking the exam would allow your A to drop off sooner. If you don't take the exam, your experience requirement will have been cut in half from 2 years to 1 year.

Based on my massive 3 months experience as a coder :)D), I feel as though coding 20 op/clinical notes is a much better indicator of whether one understands coding or not. While the current exam is long and difficult, it really isn't coding. You are already given the correct answer among 4 choices. On the job, who is going to give you the answer?

This doesn't really effect me since I'll have 1 year experience with 80 hours of classroom (current rules) or 1 year experience (proposed rule) in October. I would feel no need to take the exam in July just so that my A will drop off 3 months earlier.
 
mitchellde said:
As I stated earlier I think this is fantastic. I have no problem with expecting newly certified coders to also sit for a 20 question non multiple choice exam. I am also good with revamping the existing exam to be all fill in the blank with op notes to code. The idea is with no experience you have to show that you can take the ball and run with it. I have run into many new coders that cannot code without someone first giving them the suggestion of what the code might be. You have to be able to think independently. The provider is selecting the codes in todays world with the way the EMR is set up, but many times they are incorrect, a coder needs to know how to read the note and to be able to extract the correct codes. I worked with a billing service not long ago. they had many newly certified coders and those wanting to become certified. They allowed them to work to get the experience and then sit for the exam so as not to have an A. I suggested an exam to determine the level of expertise for each coder, a test was administered that was fill in and used the op notes and office notes from their clients. Easy right? there were only twelve questions and only 3 were op notes. It took everyone a full 8 hours to answer the questions, and the highest percentage achieved was 35%! They were all angry because the test was not multiple choice. This told me then why there were so many rejected claims and why so many denials were not being appealed. They were using the codes "suggested" by the physicians without ever considering they could be incorrect.
So to take a part of a test or even an entire test that is not multiple choice is a good thing, it is a true measure of your abilities to code. I am not sure why you would not welcome the opportunity. As far as the AAPC goes I think it is good for them to elevate the credential. I also think they are really working in the best interest of the coder by making it more apparent to the future employer that AAPC coders really do know how to code.
Click to expand...


Bravo!

Although the CPC exam is challenging, it's not an absolute indicator of coding competency, and elevating the difficulty of the CPC examination will only improve the integrity of the certification. The apprentice certification, in my mind, was well-intentioned, but generated a huge glut of inexperienced (and unemployed) would-be coders, regardless of their abilities and willingness to work. I'm glad that the AAPC has recognized this, and is moving towards re-recognizing that we are setting a higher standard.

I'll never forget the words of one of my staff members, who was struggling early on to grasp the coding concepts in my department. He said, "I passed the CPC examination, but I had no idea that it would mean that I wouldn't just be able to sit down and do this work. There's a h$ll of a lot more to this coding stuff than just passing an exam".
 
Cshaffer, CPC-A

Although I am an apprentice, I am well aware of the fact that the CPC exam is multiple choice, and in the real world there are no multiple choices. A coder DOES need to be able to read a note and pull the appropriate codes for the procedures and/or diagnoses, and that truely IS a good measure of the ability the coder has. That is why I strongly suggest that the AAPC really take a look at continuing to offer the Apprentice Program, wether it be an online or on site program, I feel that is a great way to get the "new" coders the experience and/or education that is needed in order to be a successful coder. Since there are not many providers that have the time, or the finances to train "on the job", it seems to me that someone appointed by the AAPC should lead an apprentice program (like the online program), to work with the new coders, and mentor them on the issues in a real world situation. I would rather pay for an apprentice program that's going to give me the "real world" information needed to be a certified coder, than pay for yet another test that is timed, and does NOT offer any feedback on why a code would NOT be correct, and WOULD get denied in an actual coding setting.

I am speaking from actually having attempted the on-line prgram. Although it had some bugs that needed worked out, I feel it was quite challenging and offered a very real picture of what it is truely like to be in a coding position. The program consisted of 800 doctor's notes, from EVERY specialty. It is alot of hard work, but I felt that it really showed how the real world looks and what is expected of the coder. I REALLY hope that the program will become available again soon, with the bugs worked out, because I think the program, along with a mentor to guide the coder, will make the "new" coder much more successful in understanding the field. I also feel that it will better prepare them for the challenges they will face, and how to do research in order to figure out what the proper codes may be.

One more thing about the CPC test....It is a very hard test and I don't think the fact that it IS extremely challenging should be dissmissed. But I do feel that there should be some actual, fill-in-the-blank notes included in the future. But the amount of time to complete it may need to be increased...just a thought.
 
why not revamp the existing exam, vs. adding a second exam? Just because you have one year of experience doesn't mean you can code either! I have worked with plenty of experienced coders, who were basically selecting codes based on what the person who trained them told them the right codes were for that condition. Or hey just add a modifier 25 to get paid, with no idea of what modifier 25 even means.

Make the exam more difficult, add the clinical op notes to part 2 of exam, and elevate the pass rate to 80%. I bet that most folks could get on board with that. But, keep it one exam, and make it the same for everyone.
 
"A" Removal

UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!

So much red tape to remove an initial that means nothing (other than hendering your job search) and for what? A job paying $14.00 - $20.00 hr.
 
I agree with you it is frustrating. I too am a CPC-A and have been for 4 years. No one will hire me without experience as well! Last year I had 5 different interviews and didn't get a job. This is my last year to try and the last year I will pay the 125 dollars! I paid all this money into this academy and the test fee to have to put more money to drop my A or lose my certificationl; is BS!! I think it says a lot if you pass the test without experience! The AAPC should offer a cheaper online class to take or exam should be free!
Excuse me but how can you code from op scenarios without experience to know what codes to pull if it isn't multiple choice?
 
Fighting for futures

OOOO MY GOD!!! So what do I do now? I'm one of the thousands CPC-A's that this decision will affect. I sat and passed the exam a year ago October; spent 1 year in the class room and the 2nd year just studying the coding books, page-by-page, line-by-line; took free on-line anatomy classes and every practice test I could find; now you're telling me all of my efforts may have been for not!!! There is no way that I can afford the expense of taking yet another exam. When you're living on $400 a month, it is hard enough keeping up with the yearly AAPC Membership costs, the cost of the chapter meetings, and the CEU's.

I have been hunting for a medical coding job every day for the past 14 months, sending out hundreds of resumes and made just as many cold calls, resulting in only 1 interview. The only company in 14 months, that was looking for newly accredited medical coders. I was told I was in the running for a job, but then the company decided to “reorganize”; what does that mean?:confused: So I keep looking. There is nothing out there if you don't have at least 3 to 5-5 to 7 years of experience (yes, I've even applied for those jobs too).

This is nothing more than another excuse to squeeze us for yet one more fee. How will this AAPC's new Clinical Exam, help us obtain jobs? It won't. At present the A is removed after completing 1 to 2 years of on-the-job experience; employers still request 3 to 5 - 5 to 7 years of actual on-the-job experience. So whether or not, you have an A at the end of your credentials changes nothing. Let the employers decide for themselves. With the economy in a depression/recession (whatever the politicians and economist are calling it this week, it's bad), why does it seem like we're being penalized when the hospitals, clinics, doctor offices (I've even tried senior living facilities) that no one is hiring??? . Don't hinder me anymore than I've already have been by this economy.

Now AAPC said SORRY and wants to wipe away my last 3 years because of 1 letter!!! It's not fair, it's not right, to all of the CPC-A's, like myself, who have been struggling, barely keeping our head above the flood waters. We've paid for classes and studied, we've paid and sat for the exam, and we've paid our yearly AAPC membership dues, and paid for chapter meetings. We've done everything that was asked of us, and more. SORRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :mad:If others are similar to me, we have sacrificed years of family time, knowing doing this will better ourselves and our families; so we thought. THIS IS VERY FRUSTRATING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :mad:

The NAB and the AAPC are changing the rules after the game has been played and we've gone home – now they want a do over. It's not fair; we've played your game, by your rules and won; now let us move on to the next challenge, without hindering us further. Our credentials matters (I worked very hard for that CPC); the apprentice (A) may be out dated or obsolete, but we have more than earned that CPC after our names. I demand on behalf of the thousands of current CPC-A's that we are grandfathered into the CPC credentials. Let our resumes speak for themselves, and let the employers decide.

If the objective of the apprentice (A) was to show prospective employers – an individual had passed the CPC exam. Why not, then, grandfather the CPC-A's into CPC's? We've passed our CPC exam, that fact hasn't changed, (or is the NAB & the AAPC now saying otherwise). Like it states in the AAPC's own Coding Edge article, our resumes will indicate our experience level and speak for itself. To eliminate our credentials because a group of people, sitting behind desks, who are not out in this economy job hunting, have decided our credentials are obsolete, and believes 1 letter at the end of our credentials has out lived its usefulness …. Is to discredit my time, (I've never worked harder for anything), and will now be meaningless; it is disrespectful of our commitment to try to better ourselves and our families futures.

WE'RE NOT ASKING FOR A HANDOUT; WE'RE JUST ASKING TO BE ALOWED TO KEEP WHAT WE HAVE ALREADY EARNED, NOTHING MORE, AND NOTHING LESS. THIS IS A FIGHT FOR OUR FUTURES.!!!!!!!!!!!:mad:

P.S. And Pam Brooks, I'm sure that when you were a new CPC (with or without the A), someone had to sit and endlessly train you, also. I only pray that someday I might have the same privilege.
 
Wow....I think the folks with CPC-A need to take a step back and breath. Realize, you are not required to take the new test. You can choose to keep the "A" part of the credential and continue to work towards getting experience to have the A dropped. This was just a way of removing the one thing AAPC keeps hearing is a stigma that is hindering coders looking for jobs. It was a way to give you an opportunity to take a test that is more "real world" than the multiple choice CPC exam and show how good your skills really are.

Also, AAPC asked for input. Please email your concerns to your National Advisory Board representative or to Reed Pew. If there is a consensus among the people with CPC-A that this is not a good alternative, then they will go back to the drawing board.

I have a beloved former supervisor that taught me something I will never forget, "don't bring me a problem without also bringing a solution". So everyone who is upset over this proposal needs to start thinking about viable solutions to the problem and send your solutions to AAPC.
 
I will express my concerns to the board thank you! I realize we don't have to take the test however they are trying to put a deadline on when we must have 1yr of experience. In this economy and state I live I may not have the 1 yr experience by 2013; for Gods sake it has all ready been 4 yrs! How much more waiting and patience can we take.
 
I would have to say that I agree with most of what has been posted here. I was glad when I saw that someone actually started this post.

There is also a link in the article posted in the January 2012 Coding Edge to leave your comments. I would urge all the CPC-A's to let AAPC know your concerns. I feel that if they want to change the system then it should be started from the date they have stated in the article of July1 2012 and it should affect any new coder not be retroactive back to us coders that have already taken the steps to obtain our CPC-A certification. We should be allowed to go by the requirements that were in place when we were certified.

As one person mentioned in a previous post when she obtained her RN degree and took her boards she did not have the scarlet letter A behind her RN credentials. When I graduated from dental hygiene school and then passed my Washington and Oregon board I was considered a RDH (registered dental hygienist) and not a RDH-A. And hygienists are actually working on live people. I have taken many dental hygiene state boards and can say that the CPC certification test was the most intense test I have ever taken.

Also if CPC-A's do decide to take the 20 question clinical exam and pass it what good is it to then be CPC without the 1-2 years experience that most employers require for a coding job?

Maybe the AAPC should have made it so that you would need at least 1 year of experience before signing up for the CPC exam but to change the rules on CPC-A after the fact and affect them is crazy. It is bad enough in this economy to find a job and now they are adding another test.

And what if one decides not to take the extra exam and doesn't get a job and have the 1 year experience by Dec 31 2013 is their CPC-A credential just going to be dropped where they will not have any credentials and then all the studying and money they spent for schooling, coding books, the exam, CE's and membership all for nothing?

Sharyl Leingang BS RDH CPC-A
Washington State
 
As a practicing R.N. for 30 years, I was able to get the "A" removed from my CPC because of my ICD-9 experience, which I did for Medicaid enrollments under the community-based care EDCD waiver. 18 months later, I still am unable to land any coding position because I lack 'real' coding experience; that is, I have not done any CPT coding. The presence or absence of the "A" is not the determining factor for landing a coding job - it's whether or not you have done actual coding (both ICD-9 and CPT).
 
bettinadodd said:
As a practicing R.N. for 30 years, I was able to get the "A" removed from my CPC because of my ICD-9 experience, which I did for Medicaid enrollments under the community-based care EDCD waiver. 18 months later, I still am unable to land any coding position because I lack 'real' coding experience; that is, I have not done any CPT coding. The presence or absence of the "A" is not the determining factor for landing a coding job - it's whether or not you have done actual coding (both ICD-9 and CPT).
Click to expand...

Exactly! It is all about having the experience!
 
I've been following a few threads regarding this issue I have to say that I haven't received my Coding Edge at home as of yet to read the article in question.

I think if AAPC is going to " do away with the A" then maybe as some posters have already mentioned ( maybe not in this particular thread but in another) that the actual CPC exam should have less multiple choice questions and force the examinee's to provide the cpt, icd or hcpcs codes for the scenario's. That would actually prove that someone does "know how to code" without using the process of elimination for 4 answers.

I also agree with the RN who said she doesn't have the "scarlet letter A" behind her degree. Most employers will test a coder prior to offering a position anyway. I've heard it said before that some of us who've been coding for years w/o credentials sometimes are better coders that ones who have the credential behind them and that, in my opinion comes down to someone who is not certified but has been doing the same work as someone who is certified.... boils down to alot of what people have been saying... "Experience is the best teacher". Having that hands on experience makes a world of difference (again, my opinion).

My heart goes out to the newbie's with the A behind their credentials.

I can honestly say that when I first started off after received my credentials I applied for jobs regardless if the advertisement said must have 2-3 years experience or not, you never know if you happen to get an interview even though you don't have the years of experience required and you can prove that you know how to code real op cases/ notes etc.... that speaks volumes ( in my opinion) than if you've been certified for 10 years or 1 year.

It took me 5 years after achieving my CPC credentials to land a true " coding position". And I can honestly say now ( back then no) that I am glad I wasn't offered any of those jobs I applied for because I now know that I really did need the hands on experience that I received being in the billing dept, billing supervisor etc... has made me a better coder in the longrun....

Best of luck to you all...
 
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halld1 said:
UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!

So much red tape to remove an initial that means nothing (other than hendering your job search) and for what? A job paying $14.00 - $20.00 hr.
Click to expand...

Ok, for all of you new coders who believed the hype that you can make over $40,000/yr AND/OR work from home. YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE YOUR HOMEWORK!!! If you check out the AAPC salary survey from 2010 which is when they broke it down by years of experience you'll see that most people with one year were making $16.61/hr, coders didn't get to over $20 until they had 10 years of experience ($21.96). So....if you who don't have any experience are not willing to accept jobs that are paying "$14-$20"/hr then you have no reason to complain. If you actually read the salary survey report you'll find that the people making the most money are usually self employed, are consultants or are in managment positions.

Every post from experienced coders have adivsed the newbies to take any job they can get. Yes jobs are hard to come by and if you take the front desk position you're NOT going to make $20/hr but you will be getting experience in the medical field and if you prove that you want to learn most employers will give you a chance. However, if you go into an interview expecting that because you went to school and passed a multiple choice test they're going to look at you like you're the answer to they're prayers you are sadly mistaken. Everyone has to start somewhere and most people are NOT going to start at the top. So lower your expectations and get some experience.
 
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Do I dare say this?

I know in some circles that "other" organization is a terrible thing to mention, but the AHIMA coding tests do have the format some are suggesting - both multiple choice (primarily for items like coding principles, etc) and coding questions where the code must be filled in, not multiple choice. Several other posters have made that suggestion for the CPC exam, and I say bravo, that is a good compromise between status quo and this change requiring a second test.

As for the experience, something again I will take from that "other" place is that they strongly SUGGEST, but don't require, 3 years of coding experience before taking the test. I followed that advice, and it was very beneficial for both the test and the future job prospects. Yes, I was luckier than most because I got my experience because the place where I interned (in HIM work that was not coding) liked that work, asked me if I would be a per-diem coder and did that for 4 years.

Finally, before anyone asks if that other place is so great, why am I here, I will state that AAPC is the best organization for coding materials, references, feedback and information. Discussions like this is precisely why I wanted to be part of this family as well. I discovered that long after getting into this business, but better late than never, obtained a specialty credential that is related to my current position, and will utilize AAPC benefits in the same way I have for AHIMA for years. A professional organization is only as good as the members and how the members take advantage of the opportunities is the way to advance not only the goals of the orgainzation, but also enhance the careers of the members.

Okay, off the soap box for now.
 
wbown said:
OOOO MY GOD!!! So what do I do now? I'm one of the thousands CPC-A's that this decision will affect. I sat and passed the exam a year ago October; spent 1 year in the class room and the 2nd year just studying the coding books, page-by-page, line-by-line; took free on-line anatomy classes and every practice test I could find; now you're telling me all of my efforts may have been for not!!! There is no way that I can afford the expense of taking yet another exam. When you're living on $400 a month, it is hard enough keeping up with the yearly AAPC Membership costs, the cost of the chapter meetings, and the CEU's.

I have been hunting for a medical coding job every day for the past 14 months, sending out hundreds of resumes and made just as many cold calls, resulting in only 1 interview. The only company in 14 months, that was looking for newly accredited medical coders. I was told I was in the running for a job, but then the company decided to “reorganize”; what does that mean?:confused: So I keep looking. There is nothing out there if you don't have at least 3 to 5-5 to 7 years of experience (yes, I've even applied for those jobs too).

This is nothing more than another excuse to squeeze us for yet one more fee. How will this AAPC's new Clinical Exam, help us obtain jobs? It won't. At present the A is removed after completing 1 to 2 years of on-the-job experience; employers still request 3 to 5 - 5 to 7 years of actual on-the-job experience. So whether or not, you have an A at the end of your credentials changes nothing. Let the employers decide for themselves. With the economy in a depression/recession (whatever the politicians and economist are calling it this week, it's bad), why does it seem like we're being penalized when the hospitals, clinics, doctor offices (I've even tried senior living facilities) that no one is hiring??? . Don't hinder me anymore than I've already have been by this economy.

Now AAPC said SORRY and wants to wipe away my last 3 years because of 1 letter!!! It's not fair, it's not right, to all of the CPC-A's, like myself, who have been struggling, barely keeping our head above the flood waters. We've paid for classes and studied, we've paid and sat for the exam, and we've paid our yearly AAPC membership dues, and paid for chapter meetings. We've done everything that was asked of us, and more. SORRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :mad:If others are similar to me, we have sacrificed years of family time, knowing doing this will better ourselves and our families; so we thought. THIS IS VERY FRUSTRATING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :mad:

The NAB and the AAPC are changing the rules after the game has been played and we've gone home – now they want a do over. It's not fair; we've played your game, by your rules and won; now let us move on to the next challenge, without hindering us further. Our credentials matters (I worked very hard for that CPC); the apprentice (A) may be out dated or obsolete, but we have more than earned that CPC after our names. I demand on behalf of the thousands of current CPC-A's that we are grandfathered into the CPC credentials. Let our resumes speak for themselves, and let the employers decide.

If the objective of the apprentice (A) was to show prospective employers – an individual had passed the CPC exam. Why not, then, grandfather the CPC-A's into CPC's? We've passed our CPC exam, that fact hasn't changed, (or is the NAB & the AAPC now saying otherwise). Like it states in the AAPC's own Coding Edge article, our resumes will indicate our experience level and speak for itself. To eliminate our credentials because a group of people, sitting behind desks, who are not out in this economy job hunting, have decided our credentials are obsolete, and believes 1 letter at the end of our credentials has out lived its usefulness …. Is to discredit my time, (I've never worked harder for anything), and will now be meaningless; it is disrespectful of our commitment to try to better ourselves and our families futures.

WE'RE NOT ASKING FOR A HANDOUT; WE'RE JUST ASKING TO BE ALOWED TO KEEP WHAT WE HAVE ALREADY EARNED, NOTHING MORE, AND NOTHING LESS. THIS IS A FIGHT FOR OUR FUTURES.!!!!!!!!!!!:mad:

P.S. And Pam Brooks, I'm sure that when you were a new CPC (with or without the A), someone had to sit and endlessly train you, also. I only pray that someday I might have the same privilege.
Click to expand...

wbown,

Respectfully, it is not polite to call out someone on the forums, especially Pam Brooks who does nothing on here but give GREAT advice. I know Pam, and like Pam, I took my exam after many years of coding and reimbursement experience. So no, I don't believe someone had to sit with her and train her. When I took my exam and passed, I continued in the job I had. The difference between Pam and I, and many others, may be that we are always striving to learn new things. We are like the little kids that continuously ask "why?" Not that we are better than anyone else, I don't mean it that way. We, as well as many other senior coders, continuously strive to do better and/or more. So even though we "grew up" with coding, instead of going to a school, we still started at the bottom in our field just like any coder with no experience, or like any other profession with no experience. Its called life, we may not like, it may not be fair, but it is what it is.
 
Instructors perspective

From a college instructors perspective, I could understand the "A". That being said, I also knew it was a catch 22 for the students. They spent over a year getting trained and then had a hard time getting a job because of the "A".

I say let the resume speak for itself. If you pass the exam, which everyone agrees is hard. Then you are qualified to get a coding job. Are you an excellent coder? Becoming a really good coder comes with working on the job. Just like another person mentioned that she graduated as an RN. If you are hired right after you pass your boards then your employer knows you are a new RN and need some working experience under your belt before they send you out there on your own. They have a mentor program now in a lot of hospitals for that very reason. If you pass you CPC in Jan. 2012 and get a job in March then that employer knows you passed and that you may need some time with a mentor but you are qualified to start coding.

In my opinion they could drop the "A" and extra testing. Let the resume and dates speak for experience. Most employers offer a pre-employment exam. The coder does not need any more testing then that.
 
CShaffer, CPC-A

Alicia, I was glad to see your post on this issue. As an instructor, I am sure you understand how important it is to teach your students what is to be expected of them out there in the "real world". But, I also realize just having the "book" education is not enough to be labled "Experienced", and that is why I have made the suggestion of some type of mentoring program for the "Apprentice". I don't know if you had the opportunity to see the Online program for the removal of th "A" that the AAPC initially offered, and I know I am being reppetitive in my opinions, but I still think that it was potentially a great way to give new coders a chance to experience "real world" coding. And I still believe that if this program is offered with someone to mentor them, it would greatly improve the skillls of those of us who want to continue to learn, and provide us the opportunity to ask questions that would greatly enhance our abiilities to understand how, and where, to research, in order to find solutions to coding errors that are made. Although this is not considered "experience" from an employer's point of view, it allows the coder to work towards removing the "A" status, and rewards them with the CPC credential. And believe me when I say this program IS ALOT of work, I know, because I spent my entire summer working on it and I did a tremendous amount of research. But the site went down in the midst of all this, and I personally do not feel rewarded. That being said, I think that after the coder completes this experience I think they should be awarded the CPC status and leave it up to a prospective employer to make the decision to hire, based on wether they have enough experience or by requring a pre-test prior, to determine if they think a coder has what they are looking for. If a new coder has to take a job that isn't a "coding" position in order to get their foot in the door, I think most of them would have no problems with that, but the "A" status is a label that just gets looked past by those hiring. If the CPC-A's go through an apprentice program, that just shows they are willing to work hard and I believe this dserves to be recognized by awarding the CPC status. I think this is what should be done to help the current CPC-A's, and if AAPC wants to chang the way the testing is done in the future (by adding the op notes to be coded, along with the multiple choice), then that's ok too. But I really feel the new coder would benifit GREATLY from an apprentice experience.... there just has to be someone willing to mentor us...
 
Janet

When I tested for my CPC I was proud and thankful that I passed. I had been working in a myriad of settings involving coding and documentation for years yet my CPC showed me how
little I really knew! Any CPC person is pretty much job specific, we don't know a lot about all other areas of coding but we sure do know the field we work in.

Having said that, I think the A should be left in place for one year. It is or can be expensive to get your CPC and to add yet another lengthy test at another cost seems unfair. They are still a new coder with no experience. Just because they can do op reports or office visits would be of no help to our Hospitalist company.

Jobs are hard to find with out without the A attached however being a CPC sure does open doors and I think it is up to the person to prove to the prospective employer they have what ti takes to learn and grow. I have hired people with zero coding experience because I see their potential and trust my intuition. An A after CPC would not have mattered to me.

Anyway, I love my job, I love auditing and Compliance, I am the luckiest coder I know and either way, as a coder we are WINNERS!!!!
 
I just finished a year of 20 hours a week of class room learning for medical billing and coding(I dont know how many hours of homework) . I also did 180 hours of externship. I took and passed my CPC exam. I am now looking for a job in the field.
I left a very successful career in the retail management job as I wanted a change in careers. While in my retail job, I was the hiring manager. I had to do the interviewing, hiring and training of all new imployees. What I would love to have had, is my new employees to have completed a year of schooling and a grooling exam. Then, I would have known they were serious and smart enough to do the job.
In most jobs, you get hired and then the hands on training is what gets you familiar with what you have to do with your job on a day to day basis. In the past, coders were hired without any classes and then trained in this manner.
I passed my classes with a 4.0 GPA, have a great recommendation from my extern site, and passed my CPC the first time with an 81. It amazes me that this is not enough to get me started in this field and the I have an A after my CPC.
My school is an AAPC acreditted school so I officially have 1 year experience and only need 1 more to get my A removed.
So, what company would like to hire me and give me experience. I have found that I love to learn and want to become a foremost authority in ICD-10. I have seen and it looks very interesting. The company that hires me will be more than happy to have me as I am an overachiever and always perfect anything that I do.
I dont know what is going to happen to my "A" but, it sounds like I would have been better off is I hadnt taken the test which makes no sense as there are so many coders that are not certified as it is.
Can anyone explain how this industry came from hiring anyone without schooling, and training them to people with skills learned in school that are wanting to learn and further their learning for their job that cant get hired. This sounds like a step backwards, not forward.
 
The Scarlet “A” needs to be eliminated NOW.

The Scarlet “A” needs to be eliminated NOW.
I come to the coding field from an IT background and hold numerous certifications within that field. Each certification test I passed provided me the privilege to add those letters to my resume demonstrating time in the field as well as focused study. It was my resume that let the employer know my experience and readiness for a posted position.

If I am lucky enough to gain employment, remember NO one wants to hire a CPC-Apprentice I will probably spend the year entering the same five codes listed on the superbill. My “A” is removed but I am less of a coder at the end of that year than when I passed the CPC exam.

I would drop the A designation right away for anyone who has passed the CPC exam and move to a graduated certification method.
The CPC certified professional coder would be the base line certification attained by all members of the coding field utilizing the current exam format. Some of the coders will be hired by an office that utilizes the superbill and so be it at least they will have initially learned the correct methods and understand the requirement of coding guidelines. Next level of certification and testing (questions and clinical sections) would be based on the type of treatment center you are interested in ie: inpatient-focusing on ICD-10, outpatient-focus on CPT, emergency room coding, home health care coding etc. The third tier would be the sub-specialties CPC-I, CCS-P, CCMA, CPCO and so on. Each tier requires more study and time in the field. The goal is with each additional certification attained after the CPC your earning potential goes up. Also as employers seek to provide education opportunities (HITECH meaningful use) for their staff the tier process provides that. Please remember that with the HITECH act more and more of the medical process will be absorbed by the clinical support systems within the EHR's. The graduated certification method will keep coders relevant in the EHR process.
 
Apprentice Status is "new"

Have we all forgotten how "new" the apprentice status is? It has only been in effect for a few years.

When I took the CPC exam in 2005 the requirement to sit for the exam was two years of experience. In order to even register for the exam, I had to submit two letters from employers, on letterhead, at least one of which was from my current supervisor, attesting to two years of experience with coding.

I believe there was a "student membership" that was available to those without the requisite experience. But those members also didn't sit for the exam.

In my opinion, the leaders of AAPC did a great disservice to the organization (and to legions of students) by allowing the apprentice status at all. It seems that the organization's leaders have realized this, and are now moving back to the previous system.

I am in favor of limiting the CPC to those with a certain level of experience, and that experience should come BEFORE one is allowed to sit for the exam.

That being said, I do believe that it is grossly unfair to those who have already worked so hard to pass the test, to require anything additional AFTER they have passed the test before granting them the full CPC. So, go ahead, eliminate the "A." Return to a more stringent standard of experience for those seeking to sit for the exam ... going forward.

AAPC should admit that the entire "apprentice" designation was a mistake. Grant those who passed the test their full credential (they took and passed the same test anyone WITH the requisite experience took). Their resumes will speak for themselves as they seek employment.

The organization may be smaller for a time because some of those who cannot find employment will eventually drop their membership, and those newly graduated students won't be sitting for the exam. But I believe it will be a positive step towards increased professionalism and a greater recognition of the worth of the CPC credential

Just my opinion.

F Tessa Bartels, CPC, CEMC
 
FTessaBartels said:
Have we all forgotten how "new" the apprentice status is? It has only been in effect for a few years.

When I took the CPC exam in 2005 the requirement to sit for the exam was two years of experience. In order to even register for the exam, I had to submit two letters from employers, on letterhead, at least one of which was from my current supervisor, attesting to two years of experience with coding.

I believe there was a "student membership" that was available to those without the requisite experience. But those members also didn't sit for the exam.

In my opinion, the leaders of AAPC did a great disservice to the organization (and to legions of students) by allowing the apprentice status at all. It seems that the organization's leaders have realized this, and are now moving back to the previous system.

I am in favor of limiting the CPC to those with a certain level of experience, and that experience should come BEFORE one is allowed to sit for the exam.

That being said, I do believe that it is grossly unfair to those who have already worked so hard to pass the test, to require anything additional AFTER they have passed the test before granting them the full CPC. So, go ahead, eliminate the "A." Return to a more stringent standard of experience for those seeking to sit for the exam ... going forward.

AAPC should admit that the entire "apprentice" designation was a mistake. Grant those who passed the test their full credential (they took and passed the same test anyone WITH the requisite experience took). Their resumes will speak for themselves as they seek employment.

The organization may be smaller for a time because some of those who cannot find employment will eventually drop their membership, and those newly graduated students won't be sitting for the exam. But I believe it will be a positive step towards increased professionalism and a greater recognition of the worth of the CPC credential

Just my opinion.

F Tessa Bartels, CPC, CEMC
Click to expand...

I feel that you have hit the nail on the head with your post. Very well said and to the point! Great insight to this issue and hopefully AAPC will consider what you have written.

Sharyl Leingang BS RDH CPC-A
 
I don't understand the designation of A anyways. I sat through one year of an accredited AAPC school with an externship. I also have 8 years in the business of being an insurance claims processor, a charge entry, medical billing, and payment poster. One would think my experience is all of these plus school and externship should amount to a CPC designation without an A. I've done everything regarding the process of billing and coding and completed my school with a 3.76 GPA. I don't understand why I cannot get an A designation removed. A simple employment search would verify my claims of jobs from my resume. Why can't that be enough? I've been in the industry for so long and I know what I'm doing. I've worked so hard for the last 2 years to get my license only to be told the work I've done still isn't enough. :mad:

Can CEUs be used to have the A designation removed? Can I obtain a certain number of these and it would qualify?
 
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This has certainly been an interesting thread to follow! I have so many things to say... The Apprenticeship program has actually been very helpful to me. Maybe it is because I understood the whole process right at the beginning -- my instructors explained it all to us pretty early. I had no illusions of starting out in a high-level coding position. But if I didn't have the CPC-A, I doubt I would have been hired on with no experience to do insurance followup for a large practice. If I hadn't put in my time at that job, I would definitely never have gotten my current entry-level coding position.

This was a huge career change, and it was a ton of work and sacrifice. $14-20? I've been more like $10-13 for the last two years. Low starting salaries aren't forever. My "A" will be coming off very soon -- I am gathering my documents for submission within the next few days. I guess I don't really care how they change the credentialling process from now on, but this program did work for me. I think it was intended for people just like me who enter the field with great enthusiasm but without much experience.

That being said, I know from reading the forums that CPC-A hasn't worked for everyone. I think the market is rather saturated with inexperienced coders. It sounds like AAPC is trying to move away from that, and the idea of letting one's resume speak for itself is a good one.

And if you can get a CPC credential without the A by coding 20 notes, that's a heck of a deal (even for $300). Care to guess how many I'll have coded to earn that distinction?

Jennifer Reynard, CPC-A
 
At least they get "experience" through doing an externship! We go to school and get the credential and then what?? I agree that most people do not have experience as coders, but HOW DO YOU GET EXPERIENCE if no one will give you a chance?? I am not arrogant nor stupid enough to think that I could code all scenarios or inpatient coding, but you have to start somewhere and given all the resources, software, encoders....and dare I say seasoned coders or HIT professionals that remember what it was like for them as a new coder to perhaps offer some guidance and assist in the training process?? How about this....in order to preserve your credential, it should be required that you mentor newly-credentialed coders. It's a win-win scenario. You, being a "seasoned" coder can brush up on things that you may have let slack by helping/guiding a new coder. This allows you to stay fresh and on point and helps a newbie at the same time!! :)
 
CShaffer, CPC-A

Pamps76,
I think your idea for seasoned coders to help with training process, for the new coders, is a great idea. I think if the AAPC continued to offer the Apprentice Program, and offered the seasoned coders the ceus they need to maintain their credentials to help with the training and/or mentoring process, WOULD benefit all the way around! I beleive there are probably a few that would get on board with that idea, and it would be a great way to create the bond between those who "know their stuff", and those who are eager to learn from them. And it would definately give the new coders an insight on what is expected in "the real world".
 
While this is a great thread with many good ideas and also valid concerns, please remember you all need to express these comments through the link provided in the article.
 
Coding Edge access here

bedwards said:
While this is a great thread with many good ideas and also valid concerns, please remember you all need to express these comments through the link provided in the article.
Click to expand...

That is accessed from the home page, correct? I will copy what I wrote here to that link, but I am still old school when it comes to journals - still prefer to read the paper copy and that is where I read it and made my comments.
 
bedwards said:
While this is a great thread with many good ideas and also valid concerns, please remember you all need to express these comments through the link provided in the article.
Click to expand...

Great to remind everyone again. I had mentioned this in a previous post to leave comments on the link provided in the article in the Coding Edge.
 
I was certified over a year ago and I decided to code the 800 notes that the AAPC offered to remove my Apprentice status. They shut down access to the notes due to complaints about how hard it was to code those notes. I received an email explaining that and was told that it would be revamped and then would be up and running again. When that did not happen in a timely manner I asked to be reimbursed and was sent a check. I am still wondering how I will remove my A, but feel better that they did reimburse me.
 
I too have a CPC-A, but reading all these comments is making me quite upset. Had I known that it would be this difficult to get a job in this field, then I would've stuck to my previous profession as a medical technologist with 10+ years of experience. Whether you have the experience before or after taking the exam really isn't the point to me: it's getting the experience in the first place. Doing a job search made me realize that nobody is hiring if 1: you're not certified; 2: you don't have at least 1 year of experience. People here are talking about having experience before you take the CPC exam.... HOW DO YOU DO THAT???? iT'S A CATCH-22. Another sore point is that there are no internship programs even remotely close to where I live. Another thing: most jobs want the AHIMA certification, not AAPC.

I couldn't even accept an internship right now because nobody is paying me even minimal wage to do it. I have 2 kids who would then require some daycare and after-school program; not to mention that I would need money for gas to get to the "job". How do I do that with no extra income?
 
I had the great privilege yesterday of calling a CPC-A into my office and watching the excitement on her face as I offered her a coding position. I hired this person only one month ago into an entry level position which she was eager to accept. After only a few weeks of recognizing her positive attitude, eagerness to learn, dependability and work ethic, I was thrilled to be able to place her into the position she had hoped she would eventually move into. I will reiterate what so many have said in this thread. Keep a positive attitude, be willing to accept an entry level position and then show your employer you possess all of the above mentioned traits. All of the "seasoned" coders can repeat stories of starting at the bottom up. And we will all tell you that no matter how many years of experience we have, we continue to be challenged and to learn on a daily basis. The AAPC certainly has the best interest of its members at heart. We all need to remember that they have the incredible responsibility of maintaining the integrity of our professional organization so our credentials continue to be worth all the effort each of us put into obtaining them.
 
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